How to Master Internalization: Deep Musical Insights with Saxophonist Sean Payne

Hey everyone, Louis Dowdeswell here! Welcome back to the Louis Dowdeswell Podcast blog. Recently, I had the incredible saxophonist Sean Payne in my studio, and our conversation delved deep into the art of internalizing music—a game-changer for musicians of all levels. If you're serious about improving your musicianship, you're in for a treat.

Internalization: If You Can't Hear It, You Can't Play It

Sean Payne doesn't mince words when it comes to music: "If it’s not in your head, it can’t come out properly." We dove straight into how essential internalization is, especially when improvising. Internalization isn't just knowing the notes—it's truly hearing and feeling them inside you before they hit your instrument.

Sean shared his approach with students: he often has them play straight eighth notes over blues forms, forcing clarity and preventing them from hiding behind pauses. When they stumble, he encourages singing the melody or phrase first. "Your mind fills in the gaps," he says. That's internalization at work.

Perfect Pitch: Myth or Skill?

Does perfect pitch exist? Sean doesn't think so—at least not as some magical, unattainable gift. He recounted a fascinating story of a classmate who trained herself to have perfect pitch simply by continuously referencing a single tuning fork tuned to an A.

The takeaway here? Perfect pitch—or at least incredibly strong relative pitch—is something you can develop. Sean emphasized consistent daily practice: five minutes each day tuning different notes to a single reference point can transform your ear.

Mental Practice: Become the Instrument

"You are the music. The instrument is just the tool," Sean insists. A surprising portion of his practice happens without the saxophone in hand. He mentally transcribes solos, visualizes fingerings, and even mentally rehearses tonguing exercises. This mental discipline bridges the gap between mind and muscle, sharpening musical clarity and precision.

If you haven't tried mental practice, start small. Spend ten focused minutes a day vividly visualizing playing a short phrase. When you eventually pick up your instrument, you'll notice how much smoother and more confident your playing feels.

The Serial Learner: Embracing Continuous Growth

Sean’s relentless curiosity and commitment to continuous learning became clear during our chat. After a recent gig, we ended up in a pub where I introduced the group to circular breathing with a simple straw exercise. While most gave it a casual try, Sean was immediately hooked, determined to master it right then and there. Within days, he’d transferred the skill from straw to saxophone.

That serial learner mindset, Sean explains, is crucial. It's not about always doing what's easy or comfortable; it’s about embracing challenges, pushing boundaries, and learning continuously—no shortcuts.

Keep It Simple: Writing Better Tunes

Sean recently experimented with stripping melodies back to their simplest form. By eliminating complicated rhythms and syncopations, he found more freedom to explore musical possibilities. When a melody is crystal-clear in its simplest form, you're free to interpret and improvise more creatively.

This principle also applies to large ensembles and jazz orchestration. Keeping things clear and leaving room for musicians to express their interpretations can lead to more genuine musical connections and exciting performances.

Deep Listening: Quality Beats Quantity

In a digital age of endless musical content, Sean stresses the importance of deep, repetitive listening. Rather than skimming through countless albums, he suggests immersing yourself deeply in just two or three. This depth of listening can reveal musical nuances, help internalize complex rhythms and harmonies, and build stronger musical intuition.

Sean himself often spends weeks absorbing every detail of a single album, allowing the music to fully integrate into his playing.

Facing Musical Truths: Honesty in Your Playing

Sean also shared a moment of powerful honesty from a gig with pianist Joey Calderazzo, who challenged Sean onstage for relying too heavily on comfortable patterns. That tough love prompted Sean to examine his playing deeply, pushing him toward a more authentic personal voice.

This story underscores an important lesson: confronting your musical truths and limitations can lead to genuine breakthroughs. Sometimes the most uncomfortable feedback is precisely what we need to evolve.

Final Thoughts: How Much Do You Want It?

Ultimately, musical growth boils down to your emotional commitment. "If you wanted it, you’d already be doing it," Sean says bluntly. Knowing what you need to improve is only half the battle; wanting it badly enough to put in daily effort is the real key.

So, ask yourself: How badly do you want to improve? If your actions don’t reflect that desire, clarify your goals and intentions. Once you know exactly what you want, the path to achieving it becomes clear and exciting.

Thanks again to Sean Payne for sharing such honest, actionable insights. Whether you're a seasoned musician or just getting started, take these tips to heart:

• Internalize melodies before playing.

• Train your relative pitch daily.

• Practice mentally away from your instrument.

• Embrace continuous learning.

• Simplify melodies to unlock creative freedom.

• Listen deeply rather than broadly.

• Face uncomfortable truths for authentic growth.

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Ready to put these insights into practice? Dive deeper with the full podcast episode, available on Spotify and Apple Podcasts.

Sean Payne Podcast

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